Episode 4
Why it’s so hard for many entrepreneurs to take time off from their business
Have trouble taking time off from your business?
Well, you’re not alone. A lot of entrepreneurs do.
Today, we’re not gonna tell you you have to take time off (you already know you should).
Instead, we’re digging into *why* it's so challenging to take time off.
And we’ve got some thoughts, like…
- How we define downtime/time off from the business (it’s not the “laptop lifestyle”)
- How to squash the guilt ridden “entrepreneur martyr thoughts” (like, “I didn’t work hard enough to take time off!”)
- How we should stop thinking of “downtime” as a reward and more of an essential ingredient to our business’s success
Head over to iwannacollaborate.com and let us know what you took away from this conversation.
Music credit: The Funkster by Sweet Spot
A Podcast Launch Bestie production
Transcript
Hello and welcome back to the Eavesdrop on this podcast.
Susan:I'm Jessica.
Susan:I'm Susan.
Jessica T:And today we are going to bring a topic to the table, a very, I think,
Jessica T:timely seeing as we're at the end of June, getting into the thick of summer.
Jessica T:We're gonna talk about this concept of downtime.
Jessica T:And now hear me out.
Jessica T:I know.
Jessica T:it's funny when you get these like seasonal kind of like trendy
Jessica T:topics and it's like, oh my God, I'm so tired of hearing about this.
Jessica T:Like everyone is saying the same thing.
Jessica T:So I wanna dig into, and I think this would be fun for us, Susan, to
Jessica T:talk about this concept of downtime, but here's the asterisk, we're not
Jessica T:gonna talk about like downtime is getting massages and downtime is like
Jessica T:getting a facial or a pedicure, like.
Jessica T:I, I think we all know we need to be taking downtime.
Jessica T:So I think it'd be a fun conversation for us to talk about, like, what does
Jessica T:downtime really look like and why aren't more of us as entrepreneurs taking it?
Jessica T:What do you think?
Susan:I so wanna come out of the gate swinging on that one.
Susan:I would challenge the whole notion that you just suggested here.
Susan:Oh.
Susan:Shocking.
Susan:I know, right?
Susan:So you know, this whole notion that we know.
Susan:And I'm gonna come in with a grenade flying right over
Susan:ahead and saying, I called bs.
Susan:No, you don't because if you knew you wouldn't be doing well, do what?
Susan:What, what?
Susan:What are you
Jessica T:saying?
Jessica T:People
Susan:don't know?
Susan:Knew the importance of, of taking time.
Susan:Oh, I know.
Susan:I know.
Susan:Downtime is really good for me and my business and my family.
Susan:And we hear that often, right?
Susan:Mm-hmm.
Susan:And Oh, I know, I know.
Susan:And it's like, Well, if you knew you would be doing it because you would
Susan:appreciate the actual outcomes of that downtime and how they benefit your
Susan:interpersonal personal, professional, and performance in your business.
Susan:I mean, the, the improved outcomes are measurable.
Susan:This isn't hyperbole.
Susan:This is, oh, be nice.
Jessica T:when people hear the concept of downtime, do you think that they
Jessica T:think it's one thing and therefore like, it's like, oh, downtime is going to get
Jessica T:a pedicure and I have time for that.
Jessica T:Like what do you, what do you think people perceive downtime is then?
Susan:Yeah, downtime in that scenario, I already can see it.
Susan:You're in the pedicure mere chair with your phone, your
Susan:tablet, or your Apple watch on.
Susan:it has to be radically down, different time, not halfway, but
Susan:all the way, at least in my world.
Susan:so when myself or my clients, I would truly say unplug, go radical on it.
Susan:Grab all the possible potential benefits.
Susan:And make them real, make them measurable, and more importantly, really be hyper
Susan:aware of when you come back from it and have that be the statement of what you
Susan:know, not what you think you know, or you, you are able to recall because everybody's
Susan:talking about it and everybody's, you know, repeating you to each other.
Susan:Oh yeah, I'm taking down time.
Susan:Oh yeah, I'm going, well, you know, how many people have we seen on
Susan:boats with their stupid laptops?
Susan:Or
Jessica T:I feel like you're talking to me.
Jessica T:It's like I go on a trip and it's like, why's your laptop with you?
Jessica T:I don't know.
Susan:Yeah, right.
Susan:And didn't I do a happy dance when you were in Mexico and you're like, oh, oh my
Jessica T:gosh, that.
Jessica T:Was like my worst.
Jessica T:Okay.
Jessica T:So years ago I had a nightmare that I went on an international trip.
Jessica T:this is not actual real, but I went on an international trip and it was
Jessica T:like an eight hour flight and I dreamt that I forgot my laptop and I was
Jessica T:like, I'm not gonna get any work done.
Jessica T:And then when I went to Mexico, so I went to Mexico because my
Jessica T:husband earned this sales award.
Jessica T:So his company flew us down there and I was like, great, I can't really take time
Jessica T:off because I've got other stuff going on.
Jessica T:It was a last minute kind of trip because he quickly won the award.
Jessica T:We get down there and for whatever reason, my adapter.
Jessica T:Doesn't work, my plug does not work.
Jessica T:Like nothing I bring with me works to charge my computer.
Jessica T:And my computer is such that my battery, like within two hours of
Jessica T:doing work, it's like it's dead.
Jessica T:So I'm like, I go to the front desk and I'm like, um, do you buy any
Jessica T:chance to have an Apple charger?
Jessica T:And they look at me, they're like, Just a charger.
Jessica T:They're like, no,
Susan:lost it, baby.
Susan:But they provide desperate behavior.
Susan:This is what I'm speaking to, is that a lot.
Susan:Look you, you are no different than the rest of us crazies.
Susan:That 1% who started their own business from the ground up.
Susan:Or lucky enough, you inherited it, one or the other and you
Susan:know, it's go, go, go, go, go.
Susan:Especially for us Americans, my European clients and listeners, you folks are
Susan:a little more chilled on this stuff.
Susan:We Americans we're bad.
Susan:Woo child.
Susan:We are.
Jessica T:Well, I was gonna say, you know, I think I'm such a.
Jessica T:Perfect example.
Jessica T:You know, why the hell not?
Jessica T:I'll just be totally honest.
Jessica T:Like I, it is so hard for me to like, take actual time
Susan:off.
Susan:But that's, you're making my point for me is that how many times
Susan:have we talked with our clients?
Susan:Now look, unlike that other person on the podcast here, dear listener, I
Susan:actually do leave my electronics behind.
Susan:And I'll leave it in the car.
Susan:I put the phone in the trunk, I'll close the door to the office and I
Susan:don't come back to it till Monday.
Susan:you know, if you need to get ahold of me, if there's an earthly emergency,
Susan:trust me, short of smoke signals, you're gonna find a way to get ahold of me.
Susan:So everything else is relative, right?
Susan:But it's important for us to really have that quality time away from.
Susan:And I mean all in, not halfway.
Susan:It's kind of like this idea that multitasking.
Susan:You can go multitasking and Well, I'll be the
Jessica T:first one to tell you.
Jessica T:That does not work.
Jessica T:That's it does
Susan:not.
Susan:when we first started this business, Jess, we were like, all, all, all, one more.
Susan:No, actually three more.
Susan:All, all, all in.
Susan:And honey, we were, we were going what, 24 7, 365, and three years in.
Susan:We felt it.
Susan:I mean, Charles, we felt it.
Jessica T:Well, and I think what's interesting is that there's like two
Jessica T:things that I think we can talk about as it relates to taking time off.
Jessica T:It's even like the, the.
Jessica T:I don't know if permission is the right word, but it's like the, I'm planning
Jessica T:to take time off and take actual time off and unplug and maybe that
Jessica T:looks different for different people.
Jessica T:And then there's like the seeing the benefits on the other side.
Jessica T:So I think even just the beginning stage of like, okay.
Jessica T:Okay.
Jessica T:Can I To take time
Susan:off?
Susan:Yeah.
Susan:I think there's another column.
Susan:What this whole worthiness or, well
Jessica T:see that's what I was, that's what I was gonna get into.
Jessica T:Yes.
Jessica T:I feel like there's.
Jessica T:As with anything, it's like, okay, so conceptually, Take
Jessica T:time off, just have downtime.
Jessica T:Well, that sounds on the surface so straightforward and so simple,
Jessica T:and yet it's so layered because you just, you, you nailed it.
Jessica T:It's like, okay, so there's the financial component, right?
Jessica T:So some people are in financial situations that you know, such that they cannot,
Jessica T:there's cultural, so American society, broadly speaking, and then there's like
Jessica T:the subcultures underneath that umbrella.
Jessica T:And then there's even like, How women and how women, for example, perceive
Jessica T:like, you know, the, have I earned this, the worthiness around it.
Jessica T:Maybe that's not restricted to gender, but I'm using that as an example cuz I,
Jessica T:well, just speaking from my perspective.
Jessica T:but yeah, let's dig into that whole worthiness thing.
Susan:The worthiness is deep, right?
Susan:Because, well, I, I, I think we need to bring in, um, belief systems and such
Susan:because those individuals that I've worked with, In the past 27 years, in one form or
Susan:another with small business, when there's a social or religious, demand upon them,
Susan:they'll comply and they'll, walk away from the business, for example, on a Sunday
Susan:or Friday Shabbat, those are two readily quick examples on the religious component.
Susan:But there's also, this social thing of where.
Susan:Oh, I haven't worked hard enough and I can't do it.
Susan:I'm gonna miss out.
Susan:You know, there's the, you know, the fomo, right?
Susan:The fear of missing out.
Susan:I'm gonna miss out on an opportunity.
Susan:I can't do that.
Susan:I'm not, I, I asked the family to gimme a chance to start this, and
Susan:I wanna be worthy of that trust and investment and me being able to do this.
Susan:And if I don't work 24 7 365, then I'm gonna blow it.
Susan:And it's quite frankly everything the opposite of that.
Susan:You know, the 24 7, 365, just like multitasking doesn't work.
Susan:So to that point, you asked a really good question, well, what does that look like?
Jessica T:on its surface.
Jessica T:It's like well just take time off.
Jessica T:And I think we were just unpacking, it's like, yes, but there's all the feelings
Jessica T:around the concept of taking time off.
Jessica T:And I think for a lot of people taking time off means, there's quite.
Jessica T:Space and time and I'm left to my own thoughts.
Jessica T:And there are certain things that maybe, like, I'm speaking somewhat like
Jessica T:of a personal experience here, but I think a lot of people probably do this.
Jessica T:It's the filling of time, the maintaining of busyness.
Jessica T:not busyness, not that's not leading anywhere, but like
Jessica T:the, the doing of things.
Jessica T:Because I think it's like, well, if I take time off, there's
Jessica T:the guilt, there's the fomo.
Jessica T:There's the stuff I've been avoiding not thinking about, like there's
Jessica T:a lot of, I, I saw it somewhere.
Jessica T:I forget who posted this.
Jessica T:It's not what you're
Susan:doing here though, Jess, is you're actually showing what a lot
Susan:of folks do in small businesses.
Susan:Yeah, we, yeah, went into a negotiation with the self.
Susan:Negotiating.
Susan:Right.
Susan:If I take time off, I won't feel guilty.
Susan:If I take time off, I'll be worthy.
Susan:I'm worthy of this time, so dang it, I'm doing it.
Susan:Mm-hmm.
Jessica T:Yeah, it's, it's almost like this is something where I've had to.
Jessica T:Put a significant amount of time and effort in to earn as opposed
Jessica T:to it being something that is like, well of course this is part of the
Jessica T:process rather than the reward.
Jessica T:I think it's the reward.
Jessica T:Yeah.
Jessica T:Scenario that's really a challenge for, for many
Susan:entrepreneurs.
Susan:Well, I think it because it's a qui pro quo.
Susan:If I do this, I'll get that.
Susan:If I work my back end.
Susan:Off I have earned time off.
Susan:That can work for w2, but that will never, ever, ever, ever, ever work.
Susan:One more ever for a business owner, solopreneur, entrepreneur.
Susan:It just doesn't work.
Susan:So
Jessica T:how then should we.
Jessica T:Be approaching it as opposed to the equation of like, okay, I put
Jessica T:X amount of effort and time in and therefore the reward is time off.
Jessica T:How should we then be approaching this concept of downtime and, time
Susan:off?
Susan:Well, if you had to frame it in a negotiating, if I take time off on
Susan:providing creativity and opportunity for my business, following that framework.
Susan:Oh, I see, I see, I see.
Susan:Yeah.
Jessica T:So as, as opposed to it being like that is something
Jessica T:off to the side that will never do anything for my business.
Jessica T:It is not going to do anything for me.
Jessica T:You're saying it's part of And
Susan:baked in.
Susan:Yeah.
Susan:You can't help but come back revived.
Susan:Creative, hungry to get back to it.
Susan:inspired, rested.
Susan:You know, so when the employee asks you the 10th thousandth question for
Susan:the day, you don't pop like a firework.
Susan:You know, you, you just go with the roll, right?
Susan:It doesn't bother you because you're revived.
Susan:You feel better.
Susan:You, you want to be there.
Susan:You're not required to be there, that's the fruit you get to really harvest.
Susan:As a result of taking that downtime.
Jessica T:It's interesting.
Jessica T:Okay, so I'm gonna, I'm gonna see if I can find this.
Jessica T:There was, someone shared this with me.
Jessica T:It was like a breakdown of how super creative people in our
Jessica T:culture how much time they spend.
Jessica T:Doing creative thing.
Jessica T:Now I'm not equating creative time to, to downtime, but it was really
Jessica T:cool to see a breakdown of how they ended up spending their days.
Jessica T:but in essence what you saw was these were individuals, I'm talking like Mozarts May
Jessica T:Angelou, like really great contributors and thinkers, like they were not.
Jessica T:Working, working, working, working, working all the time.
Jessica T:It was
Susan:you, you just can't, look, the really hyper creative can, I don't
Susan:ever say, I think we're speaking in general terms here, folks.
Susan:Of course.
Susan:Yeah, of course.
Susan:Um, so I don't wanna say, no, you can't, you know, that doesn't mean, no, not ever.
Susan:But on general I think we're both in agreement here with the, the
Susan:realization, if I ran a car engine at full bore on the, you were just a
Susan:Munich on the, what do you call it?
Susan:Oh, the Audubon Aon, okay.
Susan:I'm in a fast car and I'm going as fast as humanly.
Susan:Possible within reasonable bounds.
Susan:Um, and, um,
Jessica T:no, it's the autobahn.
Jessica T:You're supposed to go as fast as you possibly can in those areas,
Susan:and they, they demand that of you, by the way, but here's the thing.
Susan:I didn't manage the oil.
Susan:I didn't manage enough fuel in the tank, so what am I gonna do?
Susan:I'm blow that engine and.
Susan:Knucklehead as a result, right?
Susan:Because it was just a simple gas station stop and a quick check
Susan:of the oil, but or the coolant.
Susan:Either way, we are the equivalent of that if we're not designed.
Susan:Quite frankly, evolutionarily speaking, we have not evolved with
Susan:this current lifestyle that we enjoy.
Susan:In our human evolution, we're just not.
Susan:Um, we're not designed to go 24 7 365 somewhere, but think we know that,
Jessica T:that's what I'm saying at the top of it.
Jessica T:I'm like, I think we, we appreciate that.
Jessica T:And it's like you, you scroll Instagram and you see, I see this all the time.
Jessica T:Yeah.
Jessica T:It's like you know how you have to charge your computer battery?
Jessica T:Like you are like, like I see that stuff all the time.
Jessica T:And that's why
Susan:I, I, because the outcome of the downtime is not celebrated.
Susan:Okay.
Susan:Okay, so
Jessica T:let's take into that.
Susan:So when I suggested just a moment ago, yeah.
Susan:But we know the outcomes of the downtime.
Susan:You come back creative.
Susan:How many times have you and I taken a wonderful break and we come back
Susan:with three different programs and a new speech or a sales presentation.
Susan:Mm-hmm.
Susan:And we're stoked.
Susan:I mean, it's just like we just reached a whole new level.
Susan:Creativity, monetarily, individually, collectively.
Susan:I mean, how many, the position here is everybody should take down time.
Susan:We all know we should take down time.
Susan:We all ed, certain say, yes, we should do that.
Susan:But are we?
Susan:Mm-hmm.
Susan:And I would pretend no, we're not.
Susan:And we're not even experts at it.
Susan:We know it because, quote unquote, because we hear it as conversation points.
Susan:Yeah.
Susan:You're gonna take some downtime, so on and so forth.
Jessica T:or it makes like a cute, like quote, like a social media quote.
Jessica T:You know it like, that's what I'm
Susan:sayings, way to get me pissed off.
Susan:Do that.
Susan:But what I'm talking here about is, yeah, but.
Susan:It's not just quote unquote feelings.
Susan:These are actual measurable outcomes.
Susan:When you have down quality, downtime, and I'm talking unplug, go somewhere.
Susan:Go for a walk on the beach, go for a walk with your loved one.
Susan:Go for a walk with an animal, your pet.
Jessica T:So it's like partially first.
Jessica T:Trying to get more concrete with like, what does downtime look like for you?
Jessica T:And I think that's gonna be very subjective and look
Jessica T:different for everyone.
Jessica T:Like my default is all or nothing.
Jessica T:So for me Instead of being like, okay, so I'm gonna take that full
Jessica T:week off, I'm like, ugh, I can't, like that's that's right now is
Jessica T:not, it's like too big for me.
Jessica T:So instead it's like, okay.
Jessica T:How could I bake that in on a daily basis?
Susan:Yeah, I, I'm a huge believer in steady Eddie steps.
Susan:So yes, if you're gonna do this, try on Saturday, shutting your phone
Susan:off and hiding it, and you can go get it someday or put it away Friday
Susan:night once you leave the office.
Susan:that's how I became totally agnostic to my cell phone.
Susan:it was measurable baby steps and I think, you know, we're
Susan:behavior modifying here, right?
Susan:And we, we could go down a real deep analytical, rabbit
Susan:hole here, but we shunned.
Susan:question is really how do I create many.
Susan:Shifts that are really not threatening, really.
Susan:I can welcome it.
Susan:that is a quick one.
Susan:If you wanna take a bigger bite out of it, it's really Okay.
Susan:What habit drives you batty?
Susan:Well, for some it's, I've worked for six months and I haven't had a day off.
Susan:Well, nobody likes a martyr, by the way.
Susan:PS just, if you know you're saying that, stop it.
Susan:Nobody likes a modern, so in that moment, I would say to the person that said that,
Susan:I wonder if you could have had two real nice days off in those three month blocks.
Susan:You know?
Susan:So it really is individualistic.
Susan:It's do you wanna take on many steps or big steps?
Susan:That is the binary component to that.
Susan:I usually ask that, are you ready to take a small step or
Susan:a big step into doing this?
Susan:I have found, dear listener, the small steps work best.
Susan:Those are the ones that really stick.
Susan:They're not threatening, they're not overwhelming.
Susan:the benefits of it are quickly realized.
Susan:and here's how I usually help folks with that jazz is we'll commit to,
Susan:you know, just unplug for a day.
Susan:I mean no electronics for one day over the weekend.
Susan:And then, you know, when I connect back up with our clients, I'll just ask
Susan:him, okay, what was the experience you had when you came back to your tablet,
Susan:your laptop, your desktop, anything?
Susan:What was the experience like?
Susan:And it really is telling, it's like seeing things in black and
Susan:white and going at all color.
Susan:You know, it's really that stark of a again, broad strokes here, but
Susan:for the most part, that's a truism.
Susan:the folks that have come back and said, you know, I wanna do
Susan:radical, Well, that's usually where we build in at least a five days.
Susan:Did break during any given quarter.
Susan:What we'll do is we'll do a Monday and a Friday, so.
Susan:To get them accustomed to that because the go, go go-getters, they're gonna feel
Susan:their nervous system go into overdrive.
Susan:And that energy is really genuinely overwhelming.
Susan:And.
Susan:It's unsettling, quite honestly.
Jessica T:Well, and I, I think what you're pointing to, which is, so, you
Jessica T:know, if we take it a step beyond just this concept of downtime, you know,
Jessica T:so much of what we do with our clients and so much of how we approach business
Jessica T:ownership is having self-awareness and awareness of like, okay, so
Jessica T:what is it that you do wanna do?
Jessica T:Awareness of how you tackle challenging things and new things.
Jessica T:What I'm trying to get at, again, I'm speaking generally here.
Jessica T:So like for me, cuz I'm an all or nothing person, you'll be like,
Jessica T:okay, so let's not go for the, like, let's take five full days off.
Jessica T:Let's try like baby steps, right?
Jessica T:So, and I think some pe you know, you have to judge it and have awareness of
Jessica T:your personality and how you approach new things and how you try new things
Jessica T:that are really going to challenge you.
Susan:Yeah.
Susan:I live for the sum is better than none.
Susan:Borderline pragmatic.
Susan:but I can be very spur of the moment.
Susan:I am a genuine quick start.
Susan:If anybody understands coldy, I am a quick start to the extreme.
Susan:So, you know, I do like to shift things up and change things up, but
Susan:for those clients that are not wired that way, that's really jarring.
Susan:That's overwhelming and hard.
Susan:So to your point, you have to make it your path, but understand, They don't know it.
Susan:And that's the thing I really wanna impress upon everyone listening is that
Susan:when you hear a lot of folks collectively say, oh, I know, I know, I know.
Susan:Just simply ask, how do you know that, you know, what informs that conviction in that
Susan:statement, how do you know that, you know?
Susan:And when I've positioned that to folks, it really makes them pause, thankfully.
Susan:And they, they go into, well, wait a second.
Susan:How do I know that?
Susan:I know.
Susan:And that's, that's what we're challenging here.
Susan:I think Jess mean you just,
Jessica T:yeah.
Jessica T:Well, I think it's such a nice thing to say.
Jessica T:Right.
Jessica T:And downtime.
Jessica T:That's an exam.
Jessica T:This is just an example of it.
Jessica T:Like there's so many of these like kind of things that, like
Jessica T:we know as entrepreneurs, we know we need to take time off.
Jessica T:We know we need to take downtime, but I think it's been, it's been fun to
Jessica T:sort of dig into the like, I mean, it's always the question I love.
Jessica T:It's like, okay, so why aren't we though?
Jessica T:What's, why aren't we doing it if we know we're supposed to?
Susan:we do, because in our business, just for the, you know,
Susan:dear listener, we meet with clients for the first three weeks of the
Susan:month what do we do in the last week?
Susan:Well, we're still working.
Jessica T:We're
Susan:just not on Yeah, very much work Zoom calls, but we're
Susan:permitting and welcoming creativity.
Susan:We're shifting those behaviors, right?
Susan:So the demand on us is not necessarily client delivering services directly
Susan:to our, you know, good clients.
Susan:What it is, is, We're actually going into creative mode as
Susan:to how can we do this better?
Susan:Where will we, that's all creative energy.
Susan:That's a big shift.
Susan:Well, and I think
Jessica T:it's, I think really what you're getting at here is like the
Jessica T:way that we have interpreted taking downtime and how we approach it is
Jessica T:seeing it not as a separate from, but as a, this is a part of how we should
Jessica T:structure our time on a monthly.
Jessica T:Kind of weekly basis.
Jessica T:So I'm curious, that's like how, what it looks like in the business, but
Jessica T:like how do you foster downtime, which then in turn nurtures creativity?
Jessica T:What's that look like for you?
Susan:To me, I do something radically different.
Susan:well, I've said it a thousand times so far in our conversation here
Susan:today about unplugging, right?
Susan:So for me it is definitely putting down.
Susan:The cell phone.
Susan:but there's also, you know, homemaking, I love cooking and not so much baking.
Susan:because I am such a quick start, I love a little dash of that.
Susan:And then a little pinch of this baking requires, it's a science, right?
Susan:So I am challenging myself, which is occupying my brain
Susan:into a different activity.
Susan:So, challenge myself to bake a little bit more, have fun with it.
Susan:something that I, railed against before because I do love cooking.
Susan:but I, I've also had fun discovering baking from scratch
Jessica T:so you're thinking about something different.
Jessica T:Totally.
Jessica T:Okay.
Jessica T:And it's funny you say that cuz I think I have similar activities, but something
Jessica T:recently that I've appreciated in a way that I didn't before was Going out
Jessica T:with people and hanging out with people who are not entrepreneurs themselves.
Jessica T:Yes.
Jessica T:Because we can't talk shop, we can't go into like, you know,
Jessica T:into talking about business.
Jessica T:It's like some of my friends have like, I feel like they
Jessica T:don't even know what I really do.
Jessica T:but it's nice to have conversations.
Jessica T:delicious.
Susan:I think it's just delightfully fun because dad and I have had that experience
Susan:with our friends in show business.
Susan:We're not in show business, but we love them.
Susan:And you know, when we get together with them, we don't talk about, Hey,
Susan:how did that go producing X, Y, and Z?
Susan:We literally it.
Susan:We could care less.
Susan:We wanted to know, Hey, how was your summer?
Susan:Oh, your break.
Jessica T:Right?
Jessica T:So you're having conversations about things that are not, so it
Jessica T:it, I think it interrupts that loop of feeling like it's all you're
Jessica T:thinking about and all you're doing.
Jessica T:Mm-hmm.
Jessica T:And then naturally with any of those activities, whether it's baking,
Jessica T:cooking, or just being around people who aren't doing what you're doing,
Susan:what about your gardening?
Susan:I think that is a huge diver.
Susan:Oh, well I was
Jessica T:just giving a different example of like, okay.
Jessica T:So, you know, I think gardening is, it's one of those where I.
Jessica T:I don't know anything about anything and like you just think it's like
Jessica T:popping a plant in the soil, but there's so much more to creating
Jessica T:like soil that nurtures life.
Jessica T:So it's challenging in that way and then it just gives you a different
Jessica T:sense of like, okay, I'm adding this into my routine thoughtfully.
Jessica T:When we think of, we go back to the intention and sort of wrap up.
Jessica T:It's like I think people perceive downtime as like, I gotta take
Jessica T:like two weeks off and I gotta go do this crazy, crazy ass trip.
Jessica T:It's like, well actually no.
Jessica T:And I think we were just touch touching on it.
Jessica T:I think we see just tangibly the little moments where we do take
Jessica T:downtime, how it's benefiting us.
Jessica T:And I also,
Susan:I think what we're uncovering here too, Jess, in our conversation is that.
Susan:Downtime is not sitting on a lounge chair next to the pool,
Susan:sweating and reading a book and getting a good sun tanner burning.
Susan:Right.
Susan:it's just downtime away from what you do day to day.
Susan:And that to me it makes for an interesting person.
Susan:Oh yes.
Jessica T:Yeah.
Jessica T:You know, I love that.
Jessica T:I think that's a great
Susan:place to end it.
Susan:Yeah.
Susan:Fun fleshing that out.
Jessica T:I know it's, it's like I, if I see one more person on Facebook
Jessica T:say, we should take downtime, I'm like, okay, there's so much more.
Jessica T:I'm glad we unpacked that today.
Jessica T:It felt good.
Susan:It was necessary and fun.
Susan:So thank you dear listener.
Jessica T:catches next time.
Jessica T:We'll see you on the next episode.
